What's up with the police?

[Deleted]

Has it always been this way? Too much information? Racial stimulation by the press? Social engineering? I have my thoughts, but would like to hear others.

[bobathon]

Privilege dies hard.

[Dave's Not Here Man]

Poster Child for what the problem is with cops. And to make the problem worse, a JURY said "good boy" and the city gave him a medal.

[bobathon]

What a POS that guy is.

[Dave's Not Here Man]

3 seconds to escalate a situation that he had no justification for initiating to begin with.

He went into a complete manic episode. You could see it. Watch his jaw gritting and hands shaking. No business being a cop with that level of latent fear and lack of self control to blow the head off of an innocent person because, well, "comply or die".

And all of the cops on that scene are complicit. Even the black cop, who probably saved brother man's life. If you read about more about it, you'll find that they not only did an unlawful detainment of the man, but also an illegal search of his person and vehicle. They found nothing. So what do they do in a situation where they have someone they spent that much energy on? They tried to hang false charges on him so the whole thing would look legit.

[Deleted]

I had hoped for a little discussion on the topic instead of more examples. Lort knows there's no shortage of material. I may have been over reaching. I think to address a problem you need to identify the core and listen to all sides. If racebaitng and stereotyping worked, we would be in good shape.

[bobathon]

Different problems in different places, but I would suggest there's a culture problem. Ingrained us v them attitude, demand for complete dominating control over every situation, poorly wualified or screened candidates, contract clauses that insulate them from accountability or even the criminal process. They also do a shitty job of policing themselves.
There are also problems with techniques and practices. Having cops as outsiders swooping in to harass is like being in an occupied country, and it doesn't help. Neither do the fear driven escalations and lies/cover ups. And then there are guys like Arpaio, making empires by trodding down the downtrodden. Or what's his name near Malheur, with his 60 or so Special Deputy pals (some of who were convicted felons, but given gun/badge IIRC).

Let's also remember that they feel besieged, since in their myth eyes they are perfect and nobleprotectors of The Proper Order. So they deny that they can do wrong, even when the video shows them shooting someone unthreatening in the back. (Recent excuse: Because they suddenly couldn't absorb all the chaos around them (that shit don't fly for the dead suspect - pay attention, dead guy, FFS.)).

Now on top of all that, a lot of people who enjoy the privileges of power in this country (old conservative white guys) are seeing natural demographic change and responding with irrational racist fearz, which IMHO would make them yet more insular and fearful (and violent). Many leaders of LE fit that category.

Zat better?

[Dave's Not Here Man]

Larry there are different ways to have discussions when you are doing it online. Hell, even when I have discussions with people face to face, I find myself often using technology to illustrate, verify facts, and whatnot. I felt like my response was explaining from my point of view on the answers to your questions, with a video representation as evidence.

There's a long version of this video that show the camera running while the gentlemen involved is detained in the back of officer gunslinger's squad. It shows the group of officers inspecting every square inch of the man's vehicle, effects, and in the audio you can hear them (4 or 5 other officers) colluding to bring whatever charges, no matter how trivial, on him for having the nerve to having made contact with their authority and esteem. It's freakin sick and it shows exactly what the deal with police is. I can;t find a better way to answer your questions than what that video represents.

[Deleted]

I appreciate what you say, and that certainly illustrates a particular incident, and is reprehensible. I was just trying to see what the overall perception is, if we're about to have a civil war over this. Is this widespread or just stroked by the media? Is this bad cops, or is there something else at play? Extreme events make for bad laws, that's how we ended up with hate laws, the patriot act, and the other 2,000,000 laws on the books. It does seem that emotion is superseding discussion and being directed by the media.

[Dave's Not Here Man]

Bob, let's not completely dismiss the fact that cops are our brothers and sisters, cousins and nephews, mothers and fathers, sons and daughters, neighbors and classmates, etc etc etc and if they were raised with strong morals, expected to be upstanding and decent people, with character beyond reproach, then their positions of authority would not translate into an omnipresent enforcer of peace, justice, and civil manner. They would not be purveyors of war, death, and destruction. No. They would be peace makers and peace keepers. They would have the highest level of integrity and honor the codes and laws they are sworn to protect and uphold. They would understand that there is no point system of higher or lower values on human life, nor see everything in black and white. They also would have the self worth not to allow themselves to be indoctrinated into a false brotherhood and fortitude to NOT conform to the system's protocols for looking the other way when the when the brotherhood fails the public.

So all that is to say, if you start with people of sound, solid character, you don't have anywhere near the problems we have today.

But I can't let this go at just LEOs. It's also the entirety of the criminal justice system and it's systemic design to industrialize, and in many cases capitalize (like you mentioned with Jackass Joe) on the criminalization of just about everyone and everything unusual or non-conforming. And you can't dismiss the complete lack of uniformity (and equality) in justice when justice is called for. When a black kid selling weed gets 10 years and a white rapist gets 6 months... or a black guy driving on a suspended license gets 2 years (a guy I know) and the drunk driving white affluenza 16teen kills four innocents gets probation, counseling, and a trip to trust camp.... those are glaring examples of a justice system that is badly broken.

That's what's up.

[Dave's Not Here Man]

Oct 1, 2016 11:05:12 GMT -5 No. 1 son said:

I appreciate what you say, and that certainly illustrates a particular incident, and is reprehensible. I was just trying to see what the overall perception is, if we're about to have a civil war over this. Is this widespread or just stroked by the media? Is this bad cops, or is there something else at play? Extreme events make for bad laws, that's how we ended up with hate laws, the patriot act, and the other 2,000,000 laws on the books. It does seem that emotion is superseding discussion and being directed by the media.

Some situations are stoked by the media. I'm a huge critic of the way the media is selective in what and how it brings stories to the public. Instead of simply informing the public, it tries to manipulate the public's perceptions. Two situations that are the same in mechanics can and often will be presented with different banners and intros and sound effects, and even the persons who will present them. And sometimes one of them won't be presented at all because, among other reasons, they deem the players skin color, ethnicity, background, social standing, not the proper mixture to make the story fit a narrative.


Again, my link was more than a particular incident. It's an incident that plays itself out hundreds of times a day in America. It illustrates as well as any visual evidence I've ever seen, the attitude of masses of police officers, as well as the utter terror in their minds (he feared for his life) of the public that pose virtually no threat toward them whatsoever. That's my overall perception of cops, cowards and thugs.

[DA]

If I had to deal with the criminal element every day in my work life, I would probably be as distrusting of people as the police are. Heck, I'm against the DP, but after watching Cops, Jail, 60 Days In, or Behind Bars: Rookie Year, I'm ready to fry them.

That said, weeding out the bad cops is a lot easier said than done, and I'm not sure if any of my ideas would fix or create more problems.

[Dave's Not Here Man]

That's just it. You don't have to deal with the criminal element every day. Instead, you can get a dangerous job like a linesman or a logger, a roughneck or a fisherman.