|
Post by bobathon on Jul 19, 2018 13:50:18 GMT -5
Ah, Carrier. He rode in to save them, and Carrier implemented the plan they had before he showed up. Orchestrated nonsense. Like AF1. He’s INCREASED the program cost by about $1B. Like the Jerusalem Embassy he promised would be a mere 250K. It’s over 20M now. It’s like a modern Potemkin Village Scheme.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 19, 2018 14:27:13 GMT -5
Post by rally2xs on Jul 19, 2018 14:27:13 GMT -5
Ups and downs of changing anything. Unfortunate. The real way to do this is to take all the income-tax expenses out of manufacturing in this country by passing the FairTax, after which we would not need tariffs, our manufactured goods would fall in price due to the reduction in costs that were the income taxes, and the WTO has no rules that require a country to self-harm by having an income tax at all.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 19, 2018 15:48:59 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by bobathon on Jul 19, 2018 15:48:59 GMT -5
HEYY KOOOOL-AAAAIIIIDDDDD!
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 19, 2018 15:50:54 GMT -5
Post by minx on Jul 19, 2018 15:50:54 GMT -5
I thought the fabulous tax cuts were supposed to jump-start manufacturing.
BTW, the nail company is the *first* to start laying people off - other companies have already said that if they don't get relief from the tariff, they will be following suit.
But it's okay because 2 steel companies are going to open 1 plant each.
I am not against tariffs, but they need to be judiciously applied, and before they are applied we need to make sure that they will harm our country as little as possible in terms of retaliation. But it's all okay, because Ivanka's business interests in China will conveniently not be touched by any tariff....
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 19, 2018 15:53:09 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by bobathon on Jul 19, 2018 15:53:09 GMT -5
Well, we were in actual negotiations, but somehow we aren’t in that (and maybe some other) treaty stuff anymore. So, blind lashing out with a blunt instrument it is - tariffs
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 19, 2018 15:59:17 GMT -5
Post by Dave's Not Here Man on Jul 19, 2018 15:59:17 GMT -5
I don't feel sorry for them. Not one bit. They knew what they signed up for, now bon apetit.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 20, 2018 6:00:36 GMT -5
Post by rally2xs on Jul 20, 2018 6:00:36 GMT -5
Look, we found some corner of the economy that may be adversely affected by the tariffs. Does that mean that they are overall bad? Remains to be seen. But the President has been in office about 18 months and we have record low unemployment in several measures such as Black and Hispanic, and really low unemployment overall. Currently there exists the situation that there are more job openings in the USA than there are unemployed (people actually looking for work) to fill them, the skills necessary and the skills required not matching, or the locations of jobs and the locations of job seekers not matching. This means that, overall, Trump knows what he's doing and his detractors do not know what he is doing, nor what the are doing themselves. They are wrong.
And I just heard, once again, from some pinhead on a Fox News discussion session some liberal lie that these conditions are the result of the continuation of Obama's policies. That may even be a bigger lie than "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor." The tax cuts are a large component of this good economic situation. The tax cuts were promoted by Trump, while Obama hiked taxes on businesses and the Democrats want to rehike them and kill this prosperity all over again. Also, the massive reductions in regulations are also large in responsibilty for this returned prosperity, with Trump killing 16 unnecessary regulations for each new one created by his administration. The 16 killed regulations were created or tolerated by Obama, so that is not a "continuation of Obama policies." The list is big, Obama was exactly wrong in most things he did if he wanted to promote prosperity, and it is easy to imagine that he was attempting to suppress prosperity. Still am not sure about that, one way or the other - he either bumbled his way through his Presidency to be the 1st President since the Great Depression not to achieve a year with 3% GDP growth, or he was actively attempting to suppress prosperity, which considering his success at that, makes one wonder if it wasn't his objective all along. Obama so often denigrated America verbally and otherwise, conducting an "apology tour" and bowing to middle eastern kings, that he seemed to consider our country as basically wrong. Not sure what he thinks we're wrong about, but he conducted himself as to make us think that he thought America was generally wrong. I am so glad to be rid of him you just can't believe... and to NOT have Hillary in office who would have really continued his policies, and we would not be experiencing any kind of economic recovery. Globalists would still be shipping jobs out of the USA, and everyone could look forward to their kids and their kids eventually living in poverty or near it.
|
|
|
Post by bobathon on Jul 20, 2018 6:41:32 GMT -5
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 20, 2018 7:09:21 GMT -5
Post by rally2xs on Jul 20, 2018 7:09:21 GMT -5
Yes, I know. However, like the President, I think it is strategically important that the USA have a viable steel industry. I disagree with his way of making it happen, as I would like to eliminate all Federal income taxes to make our industries more competitive with those overseas, but either way, we need to make steel, whatever it costs.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 20, 2018 7:28:41 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by bobathon on Jul 20, 2018 7:28:41 GMT -5
Why should we have a steel industry propped up by the government? If it’s a strategic need, why is there no strategic reserve? Why isn’t it nationalized? Why is the government picking winners and losers, I thought you laissez-faire capitalists hate that. It’s a nationalistic feel-good sop for the simple, and it will continue to harm us.
I find it ironic that you would fight to the death over paying a penny more in taxes that benefit the entire country, but you’re cool with paying the tariff tax so that steel manufacturers can be more profitable than ever.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 20, 2018 8:29:51 GMT -5
Post by rally2xs on Jul 20, 2018 8:29:51 GMT -5
Why should we have a steel industry propped up by the government? If it’s a strategic need, why is there no strategic reserve? Why isn’t it nationalized? Why is the government picking winners and losers, I thought you laissez-faire capitalists hate that. It’s a nationalistic feel-good sop for the simple, and it will continue to harm us. I find it ironic that you would fight to the death over paying a penny more in taxes that benefit the entire country, but you’re cool with paying the tariff tax so that steel manufacturers can be more profitable than ever. I've read that we don't have the resources in this country to build a WW2-style battleship, if we wanted to do that, due to the lack of steel and foundry operations. That's what concerns me. We should be able to build anything we want in terms of war material, and do it without relying on furriners. Its not a commerce-based decision, but a strategic one, as far as I'm concerned.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 20, 2018 8:54:37 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by bobathon on Jul 20, 2018 8:54:37 GMT -5
WWII? Goddamn, dude. In what universe do we lack a WWII battleship’s capability? You want something blown up, we can blow it up better than ever, Mr Fucking Precision Missile Software Guy.
Join us in the 21st century some time, gramps.
|
|
|
Post by minx on Jul 20, 2018 9:11:21 GMT -5
Hold it - why do we NEED a WW2-style battleship? Technology has passed far beyond that - perhaps we should stop looking nostalgically at the past, and start focusing on training people for the jobs that are here now and will be created for the future.
Big Steel's heyday ended in 1980 while Reagan was president. The majority of men and women who worked in those plants are retirement age now. We need to face reality - those jobs are gone, but there are other manufacturing jobs here - we need to look at those and help those businesses thrive and expand. The steel horse ran out of the barn a long time ago - no sense in closing the barn door now.
|
|
|
Winning
Jul 20, 2018 12:39:13 GMT -5
Post by rally2xs on Jul 20, 2018 12:39:13 GMT -5
Hold it - why do we NEED a WW2-style battleship? We don't. But if we want to build something else that big, with that sort of armor, we should be able to. Asked by a tourist what would happen if the exocet missile that sank a British ship in the Falklands war would hit the battleship he was touring, the old Navy tour guide for the ship said, "We'd have to repaint that part." If we want a ship with that kind of armor again, we should be able to build it. From what I've read, we can't. Armor can be important. There are still exocet missiles. Only because of gov't policy. We have the iron. We have the coal to smelt. We have everything we need, except a good business environment necessary to make steel. We need "all of the above", steel, plus everything else. Did you see that the purchase of metro train cars came from, I think, France? I mean, WTF? Why aren't those built here? They should be. We should be building everything, and we shouldn't be doing it with iron ore from Minnesota being shipped out the St. Lawrence Seaway to - what? Norway? I think it's one of those Scandanavian countries - and then sent back here as steel. That sucks. That makes no sense. What makes sense is for the iron ore to be shipped to Pittsburgh, made into steel, and then maybe that gets shipped to somewhere in Ohio for making subway railcars. F Norway. F France. This shit should be made here.
|
|