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Post by minx on Jan 24, 2024 10:05:40 GMT -5
I honestly didn't know this.
If you are in prison and lucky enough to get a job because you've behaved well, you make pennies on the dollar, and most of those pennies are put aside for fines or restitution costs (this I did know). So you may be making 20 cents an hour and paying half of it for fines and restitution.
But if you get an outdoor job doing community work (think of litter pickup), you not only get paid more, but you get to keep more. So now you may be making 60 cents an hour, but you get to keep 40 cents to help with expenses and getting back on your feet.
And keep in mind that *everything* in prison costs money and you haven't seen inflation until you're locked up. Phone calls home are at least a dollar a minute. Getting a block of ramen that's a quarter in the store? Better expect to pay at least 75 cents.
Incarcerated inmates are asking for a pay raise - not a reduction in the 50% restitution rate, but to be paid what the folks doing the litter pickup are getting. I think it's reasonable. I'd also support them getting paid more with a higher amount being put towards fines. So instead of a dollar an hour, raise it to three an hour and take $2.25 for fines and restitution.
These guys should be behind bars, but they shouldn't be used for slave labor (and yes, there are laws on the books in a lot of states saying that inmates can be used at unpaid slave labor).
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Post by Dave's Not Here Man on Jan 24, 2024 10:54:24 GMT -5
Still got the morning crud, not sure my brain is ready for this one just yet. I'd have to know in what context you mean by slave labor. Slaves are people who are bought and sold regardless of what purpose they serve.
Indentured servitude by definition is probably a bit more accurate and I have no problem with it as long as we're talking only about people who are incarcerated or ordered to do community service in lieu of time.
As far as the monetary part, society is not your employer. I would do away with money and go to a credits based type of thing and the institution would have a store in which things could be purchased with credits. Want to call home and talk for 20 minutes? Then you have x credits you earned from KP or Laundry etc. Maybe someone only has a short sentence and get a day off of that per x credits.
Inmates shouldn't be allowed to have cash or sell anything inside for cash. I was just reading a story a week or two ago about a woman that was busted somewhere around here for narcotics possession and maybe some other things, and less than a couple hours after being put behind bars was caught selling drugs inside! Blows my mind to even thing there are drug problems in the prisons but it very much is.
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Post by minx on Jan 24, 2024 12:08:41 GMT -5
Mississippi and many other southern states have laws saying that prisoners can be used for any type of work without compensation. Think chain gangs. People were treated essentially as slaves - laws were put into place after reconstruction and guess what the color most of the inmates subjected to this were?
The cash is held by the prison officials, so inmates don't have cash on them - it's kind of like a credit system - you have an account with XX dollars and can use it at the commissary or to make calls. And folks on the outside can add money or buy something from the commissary on their behalf.
The barter system in prison from what I've heard would blow your ever-loving mind. And people are super ingenious at smuggling shit in, plus not every guard is upright and good.
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Post by Dave's Not Here Man on Jan 24, 2024 12:39:39 GMT -5
I hear what you're saying and I agree there's really no place for that in our justice system or it's extensions, no matter what you call it. Those people were forced to do those jobs and threatened with harm, even torture, if they didn't. I certainly hope that model of "hard time" has since been put to an end and the laws changed to prevent such methods from ever being used again.
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Post by minx on Jan 24, 2024 14:22:19 GMT -5
Sadly it hasn't been fully eliminated. But it's use has been curtailed.
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Post by Dave's Not Here Man on Jan 24, 2024 16:13:29 GMT -5
I'm sure the ACLU et al would be all over it if there were sanctioned abuse still going on. If there is, it's only because it's been buried deep. Even GITMO got told on.
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Post by minx on Jan 25, 2024 9:59:23 GMT -5
Yeah, but as the repeal of Roe V Wade has taught us, we're only one SCOTUS ruling away from re-activating all those old laws.
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Post by Dave's Not Here Man on Jan 25, 2024 10:25:39 GMT -5
True that.
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